quote:

Originally posted by Airish:
I thought Mr Greenslade had two options:

1- To answer all Loreena's questions.
2- To admit his errors.

But there was a different opcion: 'Comments are now closed on this entry' he has chosen the most cowardly way. I'm afraid we all wait for something like that.
I totally agree with D.J.Laws and IrNfromParis.

Laura

Aye Laura, I fully agree. That is a coward's way out. He could have at least humbly admitted, "I don't know the answers".
Even if he didn't know the answers, I think Loreena instructed him quite well, wouldn't one say?

Warm blessings,
Shan-Lyn

quote:

Originally posted by Very Old Elf:

<snip>

When you love or care for someone, you're generally very careful about how you share or show what you are and what happened to you. It's something which takes time.
You know, you don't say all the 1rst day you meet. You choose good moment to say an important thing (important thing to your eyes, not specially for every one).

On in the same idea, you also cherish what someone you love, gives to you.

<snip>

So for me it's unthinkable to read this book.
And if Loreena decides one day to give us something from her -as the book she planed to do- it will be much much more precious to all who love her because she would have shared part of her with us. (sorry if the verbs are not at the good time...)

<snip>

The almost dead elf

*

Dear "Elf that is alive", ;-)

These are very wise words...
Thank you for sharing them.

Warm blessings,
Shan-Lyn

I corrected my previous post and it must be now more easy to read or more coherent...(sorry, as I said, I'm "double working" since september and at the end of the week I don't know my name anymore).



I wanted to add that I'm very careful of the behaviour of Niema because it seems she has a common point with the woman who harassed me:
they show themselves has victim and person to complain.

So, I know how some people are able to do very terrible things and to obtain other people's compassion, managing by this same way to discredit their own "victim".



About forgivness... Perhaps it's a little early to write this word.
It's a long processus to arrive there and you're allowed to stop on the way.

It's true, it's a nice thing.
But, to my eyes, not very welcome one week after the end of a process and some days after big discussions about it, where the victim is still assaulted or attacked...

quote:

Originally posted by Airish:
'Comments are now closed on this entry' he has chosen the most cowardly way. I'm afraid we all wait for something like that.

Well, I'm not surprised... But what astonished me by reading last post of Loreena, it's that Greenslade is regarded as a media expert and educator and he has students !

quote:

Originally posted by dlaws99:
Don't die, Elf...

Thank you Dennis

quote:

Originally posted by Airish:
I totally agree with D.J.Laws and IrNfromParis.

Thank you too Laura.



Best regards.


-

In the short time I've been following Loreena Mckennitt's journey of self discovery and musical travel writing, I have learned what an extraordinary person she is. Her voice lifts the spirit when she sings, it awakens the mind when she speaks. Her writing translates with intelligence, authority and reason. As an example, in Loreena's open letter to The Globe entitled "Who watches the watchdog" she has completely destroyed their credibility and argument against a right to privacy, celebrity or not. Once again I've been inspired to write because Loreena Mckennitt is someone we ALL should be lisitening to regarding one's right to privacy. I completely support her right to privacy and feel justice has been served. I look
forward to Loreena's OWN words when she releases her book later this year, as has been noted on this website. It shall be a privilege to gain insight into her life based what she wants to share with us.
Thank-you Mark, QR and LM for opening up this message board and sharing all the facts of this case and to all the members for their excellent responses.
Finally, Congratulations Loreena! When I stand and appluad you and your band's performace next Sat Night in Prov. RI it will be loud and long, for a great burden has been lifted from you and for that I am overjoyed!

Robert

greetings,

since comments regarding this topic have been closed at the old-ways list and greenslade blog, i thought to offer a few simple thoughts via this public forum. in reference to niema's book, initially, i only focused on the lines but then learned to read between them. i believe that loreena was right in using the legal system as a means to protect her dignity, privacy, and livelihood. if she hadn't, then who would? finally, thoughts of forgiveness keep surfacing and i believe that the following excerpts are worthy of sharing (from a pbs commentary about "amish grace"):

"...forgiveness heals the person who offers it, freeing that person to move on in life with a greater sense of vitality and wholeness."

"In fact, forgiveness is less a matter of forgive and forget than of forgive and remember -- remembering in
ways that bring healing. When we remember we take the broken pieces of our lives -- lives that have been dismembered by tragedy and injustice -- and re-member them into something whole. Forgetting an atrocious offense, personally or corporately, may not be possible, but all of us can and do make decisions about how we remember what we cannot forget."

for more on forgiveness, please visit:

http://www.pbs.org/wnet/religionandethics/week1103/
interview5.html

chispas

I thought Mr Greenslade had two options:

1- To answer all Loreena's questions.
2- To admit his errors.

But there was a different opcion: 'Comments are now closed on this entry' he has chosen the most cowardly way. I'm afraid we all wait for something like that.
I totally agree with D.J.Laws and IrNfromParis.

Laura

Jeanne...
I've just this year become acquainted with Loreena, coming in late to the case. In fact, even though I've tried to catch up, I really didn't know Loreena's side until she explained it in her last post on Greenslade's blog. I tried to confine my observations over there to the more general issue of privacy over press freedom to which I can speak. There are two points I can make regarding McKennitt vs Ash. First is contracts and agreements are legally binding. They're there to ensure both parties are going to do what they say they're going to do. They actually protect both parties and ensure there are no surprises. Business would be chaos without them. Loreena is an astute business woman and entering into contractural agreements is something I'm sure she is well versed in. She obviously felt she had to act because you don't subject yourself to 2 and a half years of legal grief because you enjoy it. Second, harboring a grudge is a very difficult thing to do. It could go on for years, consuming you all the way. Let's hope now that the trial is over, Ms. Ash can let it go and find some peace.
You know, the day before the London concert in April, I was walking down Fleet Street and as I was taking a picture of the Royal Courts of Justice, that magnificent building, the thought crossed my mind: "hmmm...I'll bet they're in there arguing that case right now...". At the time I only thought is was a simple civil action and not the substantial case it was.

//Dennis//

Don't die, Elf...

Jeanne,

first I tried to read all you wrote, I swear. But as it's not my language + the fact that I always have difficulties to understand your way of write -I don't know why, it was the same with Artùr. Perhaps because I learned english and not american- + the fact that my posts on Greenslade's blog "costed" me a lot in energy and time and that I'm "double working" these 2 last months, I didn't understand all.


I think I 'll try to read it again tomorrow but now, one thing is catching my mind:
I understood that you red all the books of Niema (tell me if I misunderstood something).
Including the 2 books about Loreena: the first one and the second corrected version. (Am I still in?)
Well... it's always a good thing to make you own opinion by seeing, earing or reading the more you can but, I defenetly couldn't read what she wrote about Loreena knowing that Loreena doesn't want this to be red.

I don't know.

Even if I think I understood that you're "on the side of Loreena" concerning the process and you seem very compassionate with Nemia, which is humanely a good thing (and on this point, you are better than me because, if she almost catched me with her "groaning" and "plaintive" behaviour, I don't want to forget what she did), I am ... well, not "shocked" but "surprised" about the fact that you bought her books.



Even if there's nothing "crusty" in this book, giving informations, souvenirs, deep thoughts about your beliefs, your way to see the life, etc, is (or can be) an act of love.
And no one should had the right to take this to Loreena.

It's obvious for me but not easy to explain (specially that my brain is like mash potato tonight )...
When you love or care for someone, you're generally very careful about how you share or show what you are and what happened to you. It's something which takes time.
You know, you don't say all the 1rst day you meet. You choose good moment to say an important thing (important thing to your eyes, not specially for every one).

On in the same idea, you also cherish what someone you love, gives to you.



So for me it's unthinkable to read this book.
And if Loreena decides one day to give us something from her -as the book she planed to do- it will be much much more precious to all who love her because she would have shared part of her with us. (sorry if the verbs are not at the good time...)



Now, I just hope I won't discover howful mistakes or non-sens re-reading this tomorrow .


The almost dead elf



*

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Very Old Elf,

The right to protect oneself from false allegations and intrusive invasions of privacy, whether privately or publicly made, is one of the most sacred human rights we have in maintaining ones own self respect and dignity. I can only guess at how much time and energy this legal action must of taken and can only add my applause to you for taking this on and prevailing. Loreena, your music lifts our souls, your integrity as a human being lifts our hearts. Thank you for being you and letting us your fellow travellers share this time on earth with you. It is a rare privilege.

Lots of love

Hi All,

Firstly, I send congratulations to Loreena for her dignified and tenacious handeling of this case. It is clear from reading the Judge's verdict that Ms Ash was out to get whatever she could from this book and was not thinking of the consequences.

It is important to point out that in the U.K, books like these are akin to "The N. Enquirer" or "The Star" here in the States: supermarket fodder for those who like to read anything on a person of public 'interest'. It was not and cannot be construded as JOURNALISM. Call it what it was: a gossip book. The fact that she printed it herself points to the fact that no other reputable printing house would touch it.

Loreen's story goes beyond the area of 'public interest' or 'story'. There are lines that anyone with decency would not cross and yet, Ms Ash crossed them which should put most of us off her book. But human nature beng what it is, we all like a bit of gossip. I like knowing of people, but I draw the line at know ABOUT them.

For any journalist to say that this case ties their hands or somehow constrains them from doing their job, then maybe it does: as long as their job is the job of English tabloid gossip 'writing' that usually has a reading age ability of 8 years of age (The Star and Mirror for example).

Ms Ash was burned as far as she was concerned; so she went off and 'told' and rightly, she was told to stop. That's justice, for once!

Nothing about this must have been happy but I am honoured that you made the details of the case available so that we all could read for ourselves and make up our own minds! I learned a lot and one thing is always true: never do business with a friend or relative.

Well done and I am looking forward to the Lyric on Friday 19th!

Lisa

I am VERY PLEASED with this information!

Thanks to Loreena and her Team for keeping us updated on this very educational matter. I believe that Loreena's intelligence has been proved with this case. She is a remarkable woman!

Can't wait to see you soon in concert again Loreena!

I didn't post it here yet (well, I did it in a new topic in this section but I deleted all because it served nothing) but, congratulations and thank you for your strength and the good and probably tiring job.

.




PS: well, excuse me Colonel Mc Kennitt but... what do you eat at breakfast? Can I have the same? Because what you posted today ...
Well done .

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Very Old Elf,

Having followed, off and on, the issues surrounding Ms. McKennitt’s efforts to maintain privacy about her person and activities, I was pleased to read over the weekend that Niema Ash’s book will not be distributed. That outcome resonates for me on three levels. First from a legal standpoint, it is encouraging that a court has upheld some basic standards of privacy and intimacy which all of us have a right to expect – whether we are celebrities or otherwise. Ms. McKennitt should be congratulated for her willingness to become more public in this area than I am sure she would have preferred. The result she has achieved will no doubt benefit many others who seek to preserve what I would call the “sanctity of person”. Though the result in the United Kingdom will not filter down to courts in the United States, I say, Thank you!

The second level concerns the media. Those who make it their business to report the details of others’ lives will, I hope, take notice. Not just those who write “tell all” books, but those journalists who apparently feel qualified to weigh in on issues that they have not carefully researched. If they are trying only to generate readership and need to rely on the most sensational information in order to do that, then shame on them. If their motives are to generate reasoned consideration of an issue, or perhaps to comment on the foibles of the human condition, then balanced writing is of utmost importance. Without careful consideration of the available facts, that balance can’t be achieved.

Finally, a comment about friendship. Whatever the connection between these two women was, at any time, it is sad to read that one apparently felt it necessary to disclose details of a relationship which have been characterized by the courts and others as intrusive, vengeful, and, in some instances, entirely false. I have not read the book, though I will admit to having tried to order it last spring to see what the commotion was all about. Ms. Ash’s website refers to friendship and her description of the book’s content purports to reveal intimate details of Ms. McKennitt’s rise to celebrity status and all that that growth entails. Friendship and intimacy are words which, to me, imply a sense of trust – and the legal commentary appears to agree. Ms. Ash’s attempt to rely on the absence of a confidentiality agreement is truly unfortunate. Such a document doesn’t belong in a trusting relationship.

None of us are without moments of behavior that we subsequently regret. None of us when ill, stressed, grieving or facing other exigencies of life always respond as our “best” selves. To use knowledge of another’s responses during those times when attempting to develop a well-rounded picture of that individual isn’t a particularly constructive or informative exercise, unless the individual’s behavior is consistently pernicious . I have never met her, but have been fortunate to attend three performances during her recent tour. She is a more than gracious entertainer. Based on those experiences, her music, her interviews, her benevolent undertakings and her genuine interest in exploring the confines of the soul, it would be difficult to convince me that Ms. McKennitt’s outlook on life is anything but positive and reflective and that, overall, her private behavior is the same. Anyone who purports to have or have had a true and intimate friendship with another ought to take English author Dinah Craik’s wonderful description to heart:

Oh, the comfort —
the inexpressible comfort of feeling safe with a person —
having neither to weigh thoughts nor measure words,
but pouring them all right out,
just as they are,
chaff and grain together;
certain that a faithful hand will take and sift them,
keep what is worth keeping,
and then with the breath of kindness blow the rest away.

It's a satisfying thing to read through an argument as articulate, well reasoned and thoroughly grounded in common sense as Loreena's response to Siomonsomething on the Guardian blog. I don't know the gory details of the case but enough to know that this kind of thing could happen to anyone, and in this age of tabloid journalism supplanting serious journalism, ever increasing technological surveillance coupled with government policy blurring boundaries of privacy, or someone just getting mad at you, where are the defenses of our personal sovereignty? It's too bad Loreena had to fight this battle but I guess someone had to. It's also too bad we live in a world full of bottom feeders who feel the need to make a buck trading on prurient gossip. I'd be interested to know if this judgement is now cited as case law in the US and Canada in similar lawsuits.
Well done LM...

This message has been edited. Last edited by: dlaws99,

Bravo Gina! I'm agree with you! and I
fence to medieval sword ,so Loreena my sword is your!!!
Betty from Italy!